By now everyone probably knows about the fourth wall, but for those who don't, the fourth wall is the line that seperates the fantasy world of the comic and the real world. When characters interact with the audience in any way, the comic breaks the fourth wall. Often, the fourth wall gets broken on an off day, when the cartoonist just doesn't have any other ideas. However, lately I've noticed a trend that I just can't stand.
Many, many new webcomics are launching with the same, "so I'm/we're making a webcomic "story". The creators spend upwards of five to seven strips discussing the comic they are making. I personally feel that this is so overdone that there really isn't a novel way to approach this type of opening anymore. We've seen countless versions, and by now most readers just get turned off by this kind of thing. Yes, Tim Buckley did it with Ctrl Alt Del, but he left it at one comic, and then moved on to the real comic quickly. Since then, that joke has been done over and over, often as a way to justify the comic's very existence. The classic, "Oh, it's another gaming comic, but..." line appears in nearly half of new gaming comics now. I can only encourage webcomic makers to just skip this new cliche and get right to business. This type of launch story is going to turn off readers - I can tell you I've passed over many comics that open like that - and I can't say if any of them had potential, or if I'm missing out on some hidden gem because the writer used that style of opening. I can't be the only one who just can't stand the opening that immediately breaks the fourth wall - the comic that needs to explain itself.
Most webcomic makers who have been around for a while, and even more astute readers see that comics that steer clear of that fine line that is the fourth wall seem to start off better. Why is that? The simple answer is they put themselves out there by actually making the comic they intended to. It's still true that most (99.9%) of webcomics will go bust, but I haven't seen a recent comic that opens by breaking the fourth wall gain any sort of ground.
Try to avoid breaking the fourth wall. If you're making jokes, don't rehash jokes others have done before, especially if they can hurt your chances of success. It works better if the cartoonist just gets to the comic. Let the world see your work. Don't be so timid. If the comic needs work, you can identify those problems early, and make fixes., but if you've invested weeks into a comic just drawing brainstorming sessions, all that effort may be for naught; if the comic you planned to do isn't that good, people will think, "I waited all this time for THIS?" Boom. The site traffic is gone. If you have to retool and relaunch, it's just best to catch it early.
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Comments
When you say "most readers"
When you say "most readers" or "turn readers off" , don't you just mean that it's something YOU dislike? Or do you sit around with MOST readers and discuss these things? heh.. I kid.
There are MANY things that are cliche in comics as a whole, many repeating themes and sight gags. Heck, there are really only 3 or 4 setups for ANY type of joke, generally, and many people can pick those things apart and guess what's going to happen before they get to the last frame. What's the fun in that though?
I know I've skirted the 4th wall-- Yesterday's comic had my Drama Llama yelling that a train had derailed and crashed right into the comic strip and there were bodies everywhere scattered about. -- In general, I think it should be up to the creator, if he finds it something funny to do, he should do it and not worry too much what one or ten people think online. I admit it does get old though. If you did that sort of thing too often, it would get tiring and people likely wouldn't want to read it. There is a "wackyness" factor to it though, that I think a good many readers like from time to time.. almost a "Psshawhh! What an idiot!" sort or reaction.
DJ Coffman
yirmumah.net
D.J.'s got a great point:
D.J.'s got a great point: the old "most people" fallacy is alive and well. Hey, you're the critic: YOUR opinion is enough.
Still, I think Sean is talking more about breaking the fourth wall as an easy shortcut when you're just beginning your strip, and in that regard I think he's dead right. You should have a concept that's strong enough to create its own reality without using everyday reality as a crutch, at least in your first few strips. Save that joke for when it'll be UNEXPECTED.
Ah, but there is a basis for my argument...
The "most people" part does have some honest to goodness support. I've checked out plenty of comic plugging threads with a variety of different people, and whenever one of those broken-fourth-wall-intro comics comes up, people call b.s. on it, usually making the CAD reference. It's not just me; I've seen plenty others who feel the same way, and have voiced that opinion before I even chime in.
And, DJ, I did only refer to beginning a comic by breaking the fourth wall. You may have broken it today, but you work in your own way, and don't usually break that wall. When you work like that, it seems more acceptible because the cartoonist is putting in enough original effort on his or her creations and their world. Breaking the fourth wall every once and a while is no sin, especially when you do a daily comic without missing an update in god-knows-how-long, like you do.
Don't hesitate to procrastinate.
See my stuff at http://www.cuteninjagirls.com
Don't hesitate to procrastinate. My brand new comic: http://cain.bombsheltercomics.com
Yeah, I wasn't being overly
Yeah, I wasn't being overly critical on purpose. I see what you mean now.
DJ Coffman
yirmumah.net
This type of launch story is
This type of launch story is going to turn off readers - I can tell you I've passed over many comics that open like that - and I can't say if any of them had potential, or if I'm missing out on some hidden gem because the writer used that style of opening.
It's a lazy annoying cliche of a opening, okay. But there's a good rule for readers too - never, ever dismiss a strip just because of a weak beginning. Webcomic makers learn on the job, that's a necessary feature of the artform. They make their mistakes in public, and that includes those gosh-awful opening cliches. The quality at the start is no guide to what they may eventually become. That's true even in syndicated comics - the early Peanuts was a cheerful unremarkable strip, a long way from what it eventually grew into.
This maybe applies less to long-form comics which are meant to stand as single stories when completed; those do need some quality-control from the start.
While it's true that many
While it's true that many strips improve greatly from troubled beginnings, it's got to be the cartoonist's responsibility to grab readers' attention and hold it.
Exactly
Precisely. Treasure Hunters serves as a good example of what could be passed over. However, the vast majority of webcomic readers won't stay and find out just how good a comic can become, especially since there are hundreds of new comics launching every month. Maybe a few will have the good fortune of being "rediscovered", but for the most part, if it seems bad from the get-go, readers just won't bother sticking with it.
Don't hesitate to procrastinate.
See my stuff at http://www.cuteninjagirls.com
Don't hesitate to procrastinate. My brand new comic: http://cain.bombsheltercomics.com
Erics' thoughts on The Fourth Wall and New Webcomics
[quote=Sean C]the fourth wall is the line that seperates the fantasy world of the comic and the real world.[/quote]
There's an easy solution for the problem of comics that break the fourth wall: Don't build that wall. Stop making fantasy comics. Tear down the other three walls, escape from Fantasy Land, find some meaning in your own life, and put that in your comic.
[quote=Sean C]However, lately I've noticed a trend that I just can't stand. Many, many new webcomics ...[/quote]
I, too, have noticed that many begining comics artist aren't as skilled as I wish they were. Since the best way to get better is by making more comics, I suggest we institute a rule where no comics artist is allowed to create comics until they've created comics for at least five years.
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Fetus-X is the greatest comic in the world.
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Fetus-X is the greatest comic in the world.
Re: The Fourth Wall and New Webcomics
It used to be that a tv series pilot was a sample episode; nowadays instead a pilot is more usually an origin episode. I think the best way to start a tv series or a webcomic is a sample episode, whereas the fourth-wall-breaking cliche is instead comes from starting off with an origin instead. My webcomic's first strip is an origin, yes; it's also true that that's a trope today's entertainment consumers have come to expect, and you don't want to start out defying readers' expectations much. But mine also demonstrates what the comic's really about by being a gag no other webcomic could do.
Paul Gadzikowski, paul@arthurkingoftimeandspace.com
Arthur, King of Time and Space New cartoons daily
Paul Gadzikowski, paul@arthurkingoftimeandspace.com
Arthur, King of Time and Space New cartoons daily
The problem with this type
The problem with this type of beginning (and with origin episodes for tv series, a very good analogy by Paul) is the assumption that the reader/viewer already cares enough about the story to sit through potentially boring background detail. At no time does a reader care LESS about our creations than when he's reading the first few episodes for the very first time.
In general, though, I think that many of those 99.9% of webcomics that flop could be saved if the authors tried to live by this principle: never post more than three updates that suck in a row.
We all write bad updates more or less often, but if we plan a bit in advance we can organise things beforehand to alternate our weaker work with better episodes.
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Gianna
the noob
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Gianna Masetti
thenoobcomic.com
I think you are wrong! The
I think you are wrong!
The beuty of webcomics its that you can write and do everything you like in your comic.
Even in famous print comics!. In Akira Toryama early Dr SLUMP manga he drew himself as a character
(as robot because he works like one)and didnt make that comic a FAILURE.
PILLI ADVENTURE
http://pilli.smackjeeves.com/comics/
Cerebus broke the 4th wall.
I think Dave Sim pulled it off magnificently when he had Cerebus meet his "creator."
Fabricari - Sexy Robots and Violent Cyberpunk Comics
Steve "Fabricari" Harrison
That depends on whether your
That depends on whether your purpose is to do whatever you want or to attract readers, or a combination of both.
Paul Gadzikowski, paul@arthurkingoftimeandspace.com
Arthur, King of Time and Space New cartoons daily
Paul Gadzikowski, paul@arthurkingoftimeandspace.com
Arthur, King of Time and Space New cartoons daily
So did Grant Morrison...
Animal Man, in that famous mini, met his writer after gaining advanced awareness, and that story succeeded, and was very well done. However, the issue here deals with a comic creator immediatly inserting him/herself into the comic, rather than actually establishing the concepts or the characters that are in the comic that creator eventually intends to do.
Gianna hit the nail on the head. A new cartoonist has to realize, that, like every other comic creator out there, the audience just doens't give a damn about them until they can produce GOOD material. The creator has to prove their worth to the readers. Ultimately, it's what they create, rather than what they have to say about themselves, that makes them memorable. I know, I know there are some popular journal comics out there, so don't try to get me on that. The journal comics that succeed are well done, and presented in a manner that makes an "autobiographical" comic enjoyable and appealing. Often, these creators will exaggerate their own lives to make the product more enjoyable to read. When this happens, they seperate themselves from their toon counterparts, creating, in essence, a second reality in which to work.
Don't hesitate to procrastinate.
See my stuff at http://www.cuteninjagirls.com
Don't hesitate to procrastinate. My brand new comic: http://cain.bombsheltercomics.com
My way around that...
I do see the point you're making, and agree with it to a certain extent even though the first four strips I made for my comic did break the fourth wall. However I also did them about a month before the site officially launched and they were mostly an exercise for me to get used to using PhotoShop rather than an intro into the strip itself. As such when I set up my archives I did it in a way that these "pre-launch" strips are in a separate section from the story based ones, so that when people click to read the first comic, they are sent to the beginning of the actual storyline and not the fourth wall breaker ones.
Now whether setting the archives up like that has helped me turn less readers off...I don't know. I've always felt that the latest couple of updates are what's going to hook the reader, not the first few. For myself, I usually look back through the last three or four of the most current updates before I head to the beginning. And if the most current strips seemed strong, I tend to be rather forgiving about the earlier ones, as I’ve found that a fair number of good webcomics were pretty awful to begin with.
Hacker, Slacker, Grifter, Ghost...
www.geektragedy.com